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Democracy and the need for ordinary citizens to bear arms

Discussions on the Right to Keep and Bear Arms.
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mundaire
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Democracy and the need for ordinary citizens to bear arms

Postby mundaire » Fri Sep 30, 2016 3:32 pm

https://youtu.be/EMg0AF_B_es

This video is in Hindi, be great if someone could post a translation for the benefit of members who do not know Hindi.

Cheers!
Abhijeet


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StampMaster
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Re: Democracy and the need for ordinary citizens to bear arms

Postby StampMaster » Mon Oct 03, 2016 3:28 pm

Namaskar, this is Rahul Mehta from Right to Recall Group. Our intention is to bring back Right to Recall in India. This is a 15 minute video. There is another video on military, its 45-55 minutes long.

This video is about Right to Bear Arms, means every person can own weapon. Reference material is available on http://www.rahulmehta.com/301.html . In chapter 26 and 29 , Weaponization of Commons.

There is a law in Switzerland, that people aged from 25 – 45 (I may be wrong with the number) should own a weapon. If someone does not own one, then he would be punished under law. Same law has to be implemented in India for the following reasons.

1. Military will be strong. When a person handles (fires) weapon, he will understand the value and power it has. So he can estimate how much power does a tank, missiles etc has and if the government and politicians are making our armed forces stronger or weaker. A person will be able to understand practicality of weapons.
2. We India, buy most of our weapons from foreign countries. For any reason, if we don’t get spares etc our armed forces will get weak. To avoid any such situation happening, individual owning arms will be able to fight back and support our military
One reason for Russian win WW2 was because of Staling idea of arming his citizens.
Nazi general advised Hitler not to wage war with Swiss, as most of the citizen own firearms attacking them would be counterproductive.
3. Democracy- When people own arms then the democracy will work in the right state and follow laws. Which lead to decrease in red tapism and reduction in bureaucratic behavior.
4. During the 1929 great depression, America has started welfare state immediately. As they knew that most of their citizens are armed. Government and bureaucrats knew that even police or armed forces cannot manage such large armed population revolting, so introduced Social Security at the earliest.
5. During drought in 1942 in India, about 30-40 lakh (3-4 million) people died of starvation. Ruling British and Indian elites were still living in luxury. As the common man does not own arms to revolt against inefficient corrupt government.

In short, where nations citizens own arms, democracy is maintained to its highest standards. And ruling class behave in disciplined manner.

In 1931, Jawahar Lal Nehru, Sardar Vallabhai Patel and Mohan Pai written a congress resolution during Karachi meet to make Owning Arms to be made as a Fundamental Right. But that has been forgotten by everone after independence.

Only when it come to this context- Right to Bear Arms come in to picture, I call Gandhi as Mahamatma Gandhi, in everything else I call him Satan.

When we read about other countries, England has started democratic state in 950 AD and jury system was started. And in 1100 AD they have to bring democracy in effect and elect leaders as they were continuously waging wars with Arabs. So the elites in England had trained their citizens and provided them with arms.

Today when people say owning firearms is easy but there are no moral value in society, then please apply for arms license. In Ahmedabad, Gujrat the price (greasing hand) for getting an arms license in about 2-2.5 lakh (Rs 200000- 250000 or USD 3000 to 4000) in any police station unless you have high level political connections.

Rowdy sheeters and anti-social elements can easily manage to get arms because of money and sometime political connections. Any an ordinary citizens like us in need of security cannot afford to spend big monies. Sometimes a needy middle class person cannot even get license after waiting for 2-3 or 10 years

I propose a law that every citizens should be able to own arms till a person is proven unfit. Until, a jury trial will decide a person is convicted and felony. Except that all other citizens above the age of 18 should be able to own firearms. And not just own but also trained and it should be made mandatory.

Terrorists like Kasab (attacks of 26/11 in Mumbai) have created mayhem in Mumbai killing 300-400 innocent citizens. This could have been minimized if people were allowed to own arms. Even at Taj hotel Mumbai attack, not one of the guest had arms to counter and minimize the damage.

In Israeli, during emergency and terrorism attack situation, armed citizens (owning arms is easy) immediately neutralize the terror event planned. Any events like 26/11 (Mumbai kind of events), if ever happens in Israel, then such events would have be finished in less than 30 minutes and Police would have come at the end just to pick up the terrorist dead bodies.

Our present war like situation (we cannot predict the time of war). If China wages war against India. May not directly but through Pakistan as proxy then Pakistan can create a havoc in India. We India cannot fight back with China with the military infrastructure we have. So our border forces may get weaken and people from Pakistan may flood into India. And most of the citizens in Pakistan own weapons. Pakistan citizens own more than 1-1.5 crore (10-15 million AK-57 assault rifles) and whole of our defense owns hardly 30-40 lakh (3-4 million) including all the armed forces, police, paramilitary etc. In case of attack by a large number in tens of thousands of Pakistan civilian population may infiltrate India. During such situation, if all Indians are armed we can minimize such situations and keep our borders and territory safe and in Indian control.

So, I request that the govt has to allow individuals to own and bear weapons. And request all individuals to apply for arms license without paying bribe and without any political influence. And share this with your friends.

Collector/ DM, Police commissioner in your areas are unofficially been notified by the govt to control arms license and been strict quote not to exceed. Which result in increase in corruption proportionately to the limited number of license to be provided.

Increase in armed citizen will increase in crime rate is all foolishly publicized. Places and countries where arms laws are favoring to keep and bear arms, the crime rate is absolute minimal.
For example, which state have higher crime rates in America? Only in those states where arms laws are not liberal. Swiss has lot less crime rate than in India. France and Britain.

Mugging is also less in the places where law abiding citizens owning guns are high. Rape rates are also low countries with high gun ownership states.

This is my proposal- Weaponisation of us Commons. A gazette notification is sufficient to the licensing authority to allow all citizen (except with criminal background, and unsound mind) to be allowed to own and bear arms.

Thank you.



Note- Thanks to Mr. Shashank, my friend who has translated the above video.


”Criminals love gun control; it makes their jobs safer.”

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mundaire
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Re: Democracy and the need for ordinary citizens to bear arms

Postby mundaire » Mon Oct 03, 2016 5:08 pm

Once again, thank you for the translation StampMaster (y) :)

Cheers!
Abhijeet


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Re: Democracy and the need for ordinary citizens to bear arms

Postby captrakshitsharma » Wed Oct 12, 2016 4:38 pm

Stamp Master i must congratulate you on your great work! We look at having a long and fruitful association with you.


I dont dial 911... I dial .357

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James_Bond
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Re: Democracy and the need for ordinary citizens to bear arms

Postby James_Bond » Wed Jan 18, 2017 10:44 pm

it is the truth. Any govt wants to control the life of comman man. It may be possbile than in feature comman man forced to deposit there arms by hook or crook by hiking the renewal and fresh license fee( Presently in Himachal Fee for renewal of license is hike its now 1600 to 3000( old 160)


With Regards
CODE NAME BOND, JAMES BOND LICENSE TO RKBA

K1eaner
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Re: Democracy and the need for ordinary citizens to bear arms

Postby K1eaner » Thu Jan 19, 2017 2:06 pm

Personally, any responsible citizen should be allowed to own firearms. But, we have to move as fast as our slowest individual. Such is a society, the country and the world.



PRITAM PATEL
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Re: Democracy and the need for ordinary citizens to bear arms

Postby PRITAM PATEL » Fri Jan 20, 2017 12:09 am

controll.jpg


regards
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goodboy_mentor
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Re: Democracy and the need for ordinary citizens to bear arms

Postby goodboy_mentor » Fri Jan 20, 2017 5:16 pm

It is said the mind of oppressed is the greatest weapon in the hands of oppressor. The political ideology of control by mind control is based on this very fact. The political ideology of control by mind control is product of colonialism/ imperialism wherein the common people are slowly made to internalize in their consciousness to accept slavery by control as very necessary for their survival and welfare. They are unable to identify the attacks to control or ultimately use them as mindless slaves. Thus it is not surprising why unlike America, gun control by the British did not raise any rebellion in the Indian sub continent. They were unable to identify the game that was being played. If one analyzes the revolt of 1857 it was not sparked by some desire for freedom from British rule. On the contrary it was about animal rights(of specific animals), pension and inheritance rights(Doctrine of Lapse) by the very people who were till then actively complicit in supporting the British rule! It is not surprising why similar things are even happening today. Demagogues of the ruling elite are controlling the minds by spreading the agenda of control in one way or the other, while very few are able to decode the hidden agenda. And what remains without understanding of the real game and RKBA is just a drama or smokescreen of democracy enforced by mind control by the ruling elite.


All things are subject to interpretation whichever interpretation prevails at a given time is a function of power and not truth. - Friedrich Nietzsche

PRITAM PATEL
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Re: Democracy and the need for ordinary citizens to bear arms

Postby PRITAM PATEL » Sat Jan 21, 2017 11:24 pm

goodboy_mentor wrote:Demagogues of theruling elite are controlling the minds by spreading the agenda of control in one way or the other, while very few are able to decode the hidden agenda. And what remains without understanding of the real game and RKBA is just a drama or smokescreen of democracy enforced by mind control by the ruling elite.


very well said,

regards


"Men like us don't deserve to die in the bed, field would be a batter option"

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Huligun
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Re: Democracy and the need for ordinary citizens to bear arms

Postby Huligun » Sun Jan 22, 2017 12:10 am

Well translated and good video! very informative



goodboy_mentor
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Re: Democracy and the need for ordinary citizens to bear arms

Postby goodboy_mentor » Thu Jan 26, 2017 1:14 pm

So long there are "believers" of the self destructive Chanakya Neeti in the ruling elite, there cannot be any democracy or RKBA. They will keep on implementing the self destructive policies of Chanakya Neeti on their own citizens and bring the slow and steady downfall of the Indian State. They have historically done same self destruction on number of occasions all through the history of this sub continent. Mentioned about one Chanakya's silly quote against RKBA in this post viewtopic.php?f=1&t=24748#p246348


All things are subject to interpretation whichever interpretation prevails at a given time is a function of power and not truth. - Friedrich Nietzsche

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vedula1995
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Re: Democracy and the need for ordinary citizens to bear arms

Postby vedula1995 » Sun Jan 29, 2017 12:28 pm

Should I don't have the right to shoot the person who comes in and rob my place,because our govt are unwise and slow,our police system are not responsive?

Should my sister who lives alone in home not have the right to shoot the person in leg if he barges in to rape her?

Should we not have the equal stand off right when Kasab is shooting at me from the opposite platform? Who is Indian Govt to decide whether should I live or die at that particular moment?

Who is to decide whether police personnel or rightful citizens should have gun?

What makes police better than us? They are mere mortals behind the brown cloths and have misused their power in recent years.

I want you all to question to authorities,can we people form a Telegram Group and work on this thing? form a peace movement of piling up documents and case study of the country's with liberal gun laws and low crime rate?

Let's Unite Brothers,first they hit us in 1800's if only if we would have enough weapons to scare off the colonial rulers we would have been in much better state by now.

Learn to fight countrymen,fight was always a human instinct and shouldn't be deemed illegal,don't let the elites dominate you while they are laughing at you from their ivory tower.


FIGHT BACK FOR YOUR RIGHTS.



goodboy_mentor
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Re: Democracy and the need for ordinary citizens to bear arms

Postby goodboy_mentor » Tue Jan 31, 2017 9:12 pm

vedula1995 wrote:Should I don't have the right to shoot the person who comes in and rob my place,because our govt are unwise and slow,our police system are not responsive?

Should my sister who lives alone in home not have the right to shoot the person in leg if he barges in to rape her?

Should we not have the equal stand off right when Kasab is shooting at me from the opposite platform? Who is Indian Govt to decide whether should I live or die at that particular moment?

Who is to decide whether police personnel or rightful citizens should have gun?

What makes police better than us? They are mere mortals behind the brown cloths and have misused their power in recent years.
Right of Private Defense and right to keep and bear arms are a basic human rights. Right of Private Defense is defined from Sections 96 to 106 of Indian Penal Code. These Sections can be read on internet.

Supreme Court has given a number of judgments in support of right of private defense. May read this for details in this post viewtopic.php?f=4&t=24511&start=120#p243291

May also read these posts viewtopic.php?f=4&t=24511&start=135#p243601 and viewtopic.php?f=3&t=23372&start=30#p230480

Then where is the problems? The problem is that by playing legal trickery, the law of right of private defense has been clandestinely and cunningly subverted to make it ineffectual, by denying effective tools(firearms) for right of private defense.
vedula1995 wrote:I want you all to question to authorities,can we people form a Telegram Group and work on this thing? form a peace movement of piling up documents and case study of the country's with liberal gun laws and low crime rate?

Let's Unite Brothers,first they hit us in 1800's if only if we would have enough weapons to scare off the colonial rulers we would have been in much better state by now.

Learn to fight countrymen,fight was always a human instinct and shouldn't be deemed illegal,don't let the elites dominate you while they are laughing at you from their ivory tower.
Yes everyone must always use end to end encryption for any and every communications. Telegram, Pidgin with Off The Record(OTR) Messaging Plugin etc. are good for secure communications. There are plenty of free and open source software available. Why should anyone be listening to one's private communications like between you and your girlfriend?

Yes we must ask proper questions and get proper answers. We will ask proper questions only if we are aware of the political and legal game that is being played with us. One organization NAGRI has already been created. This is it's website http://gunowners.in/ Every reader of this forum may get in touch with it's office bears. Local chapters of NAGRI may be started in every city and village and hold regular local meetings to chalk out agenda and plan of action with practically achievable targets.
vedula1995 wrote:FIGHT BACK FOR YOUR RIGHTS.
Taking a lost right back is like snatching a sugarcane from the mouth of an elephant. I am not being negative or trying to discourage. Only saying the matter is not impossible but difficult. The difficulty can be overcome by spreading awareness and properly organizing. Try to get in touch with people connected with organizations fighting for civil rights, human rights etc., those in the media, post in other online forums. There is lot of information related to importance of Right of Private Defence, RKBA, it's Constitutional and legal position, the judgments of Supreme Court on this website itself, share these posts online on the social media. There are so many ways to spread awareness.


All things are subject to interpretation whichever interpretation prevails at a given time is a function of power and not truth. - Friedrich Nietzsche

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mundaire
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Re: Democracy and the need for ordinary citizens to bear arms

Postby mundaire » Thu Feb 02, 2017 8:08 pm

Well said GBM! (y) :)


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Afaque
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Re: Democracy and the need for ordinary citizens to bear arms

Postby Afaque » Fri Mar 03, 2017 2:21 pm

Lmao ....you guys are hillarious .We are living in a era now where having currency notes is considered a luxury and you guys think our PM will give permission for firearms for all citizens?.Lol..I am with you guys,hope you understand my sarcacism in my comment and not take it negatively.

I totally agree owning firearms by common citizens will lower the crime rate .Jai hind.




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