A new Rimfire cartridge

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xl_target
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A new Rimfire cartridge

Post by xl_target » Sat Jan 05, 2013 10:57 am

Introducing the New .17 Winchester Super Magnum

Image
I’m a sucker for rimfires. From the lowly .22 BB to the hottest .22 Winchester Magnum, the rimfire serves a lot of roles: plinker, competitor, small-game getter and predator taker. The rimfire is America’s darling: fun to shoot, cheap to use, and just plain efficient. But do we need another one? In the .22 genre about every conceivable option has been created from primer-only BB caps for indoor plinking to hyper-velocity squirrel thumpers. We have necked the .22 down to .20 and .17 calibers over the years and pretty much covered all the bases. Or at least I thought we had. Then I met Brad Criner, Winchester Ammunition’s Rimfire Senior Product Manager.

“This is not jut a hotter loaded .17 HMR,” Brad said as we drove out to my local range. To prove his point he handed me both an HMR and the new .17 Win. Super Mag. Side by side it was easy to see the difference; it was like comparing a .30-06 to a .300 Winchester Magnum…which in a way is not a bad analogy, just on a smaller scale. “We have a power fastener division of the company…you know, they make cartridges for power nail guns and such. Well, we based this case off of the .27-caliber power fastener case. It gives us more case capacity, can handle higher pressures and ultimately more velocity. Lots more velocity.”

When Brad said lots more velocity, he wasn’t exaggerating. Comparing apples to apples, the .17 Win. Super Mag. puts out roughly 21 percent more velocity with a 20-grain bullet than the HMR. Comparing apples to oranges, the Win. Super Mag. does something the HMR simply doesn’t do—it can be loaded with 25-grain bullets, which is just what I want for bobcat, fox, and coyotes.

I tested the HMR years ago when it first came out and shot a couple of big Nebraska coyotes with it. It worked, but did not shine. More bullet weight and more speed would have made a big difference. Holding the new .17, I realized the big difference had arrived.

The new load from Winchester spits out the 20-grainer at 3,000 fps and a 25-grain load at 2,600 fps with energy levels right at 400 ft. lbs. and 375 ft. lbs. respectively—150 pounds more than the 17 HMR and solid 60 foot pounds more than the hottest .22 Winchester Magnum loading!

When it comes to critical factors like wind drift and drop, the Winchester Super Magnum beats the HMR by half, and when it comes to the wind-challenged .22 Win. Mag., it simply leaves it in the dust.



Read more: http://www.petersenshunting.com/2013/01 ... z2H4lP6qyM
How does it shoot?
That was the question of the day. Yes, the purpose of my trip to the range was to run some of these new loads through the chronograph, but I also wanted to see how the smoking little load would perform on paper. I should have known I wouldn’t be disappointed. Like all .17s I have ever shot (from the .17 Mach II to the .17 Remington), the accuracy was stunning—even though this test day was far from perfect.

It was blustery, and I was shooting two very early prototype guns from Savage, topped with Nikon Coyote Special scopes, which are ideal for hunting, but not my first choice for target testing due to their circle reticle. Like an idiot, I left my good shooting rest and rear bag in the back of my truck when I excitedly jumped into Brad’s vehicle. So I had to make do with a backpack off a concrete bench as my support. After all of these excuses, guess what? I got tiny little groups!

The first three shots at 100 yards made one ragged little cluster around a half-inch. Stretching the distance out to 200 yards, I was rewarded with four shots around .75 inch with a fifth flyer (that I pulled; my fault) that opened up the group to a bit over an inch. Impressive by any standards, and simply incredible for a rimfire with a lousy rest on a blustery day out of a prototype rifle.



Read more: http://www.petersenshunting.com/2013/01 ... z2H4lao4uz
“Never give in, never give in, never; never; never; never – in nothing, great or small, large or petty – never give in except to convictions of honor and good sense” — Winston Churchill, Oct 29, 1941

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Mark
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Re: A new Rimfire cartridge

Post by Mark » Sat Jan 05, 2013 11:49 am

That will be an interesting cartridge. If it finds a niche such as people who hunt coyotes and foxes for pelts it might actually make it.
"What if he had no knife? In that case he would not be a good bushman so there is no need to consider the possibility." H.A. Lindsay, 1947

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Re: A new Rimfire cartridge

Post by Vikram » Sat Jan 05, 2013 3:43 pm

Thanks for yet another interesting thread,XL.

I would agree with,Mark. I wonder how it is priced. Must be more expensive than .17HMR. For plinkers, price is an important consideration and the .22lr shines a lot brighter there.

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Re: A new Rimfire cartridge

Post by TC » Sat Jan 05, 2013 4:31 pm

And, like so many new factory loads and wildcats that have come and gone, we Indians will miss this one too ...

Thanks Xl... threads like these at least help me understand why I am losing interest in guns and shifting my focus on gun rights

Cheers

TC

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Re: A new Rimfire cartridge

Post by Grumpy » Sun Apr 28, 2013 7:50 pm

Oh I`d love to see that make it into production ..... and just hope that it has more success than the various .22 rimfire super mags which have been about to make it into production so many times over the years but never have.
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Re: A new Rimfire cartridge

Post by Grumpy » Sun Apr 28, 2013 8:04 pm

Wow.... ammo should be available now ( between $15-$20 a box of 50 ) and a new Savage bolt action rifle to suit should also be available now.
Right ..... guess what my next rifle is going to be ? !
Make a man a fire and he`ll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he will be warm for the rest of his life.
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Re: A new Rimfire cartridge

Post by shooter » Mon Apr 29, 2013 12:28 am

This calibre is something i have looked forward to since 2012.
We even put an article on my mates blog. I really want this but the [email protected]#%*&+ laws here make it a pain in the a*$£ to get a permit.

http://suburbanbushwacker.blogspot.co.u ... nista.html
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Re: A new Rimfire cartridge

Post by Grumpy » Mon Apr 29, 2013 12:58 am

How come you didn`t tell me about it Dev ? I knew nothing of the .17 Win Super Mag until I read this earlier this afternoon.
Actually, as I`ve been muttering about getting a Browning T-Bolt in in .17 HMR for ages this thread is really timely because I`ve only the one slot for a .17 rimfire. I`ll even get a Savage if necessary .... unless Browning come up with a T-Bolt in .17 WSM very quickly.
I know what this is calibre is going to get a lot of use for in the UK ..... where, with the 25 gr, it is likely to take over from the .22 WMR ...... but I won`t go into that.
Haven`t you got a .17 variation on your licence ? Easy down yur in the sticks cos our local FLD much prefers the .17 HMR to .22 lrs because of the smaller risk of ricochets.
Make a man a fire and he`ll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he will be warm for the rest of his life.
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Re: A new Rimfire cartridge

Post by shooter » Mon Apr 29, 2013 1:21 am

Hi Grumpy,
Winchester announced last year that they are going to launch something big; telling its customers to be on the lookout.
I heard about it when I was doing some rerearch after you wrote to me about the SX3 semi; the result came up on google.
Then there was a discussion on some other forums re: what it might be. I found out about it on the day of the launch. In fact the link above was the first result on google search (even above winchester site) for a good 6 weeks. We even thought about writing to savage to send me the rifle to test fire it and write a review. Anyway as you are aware, personal stuff, travel prevented me from pursuing it.

I just assumed that if I know about something, you would obviosly know about it.

I stupidly put ".17 HMR" on my ticket rather than ".17". So now will hav to go thru all the b£@@&^ paperwork and for what? My HMR shoots well. I have already crossed a century of rabbit head shots with it. UK police wont allow it on deer or foxes. So might well try yours.
You want more gun control? Use both hands!

God made man and God made woman, but Samuel Colt made them equal.

One does not hunt in order to kill; on the contrary, one kills in order to have hunted. by Jose Gasset.

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Re: A new Rimfire cartridge

Post by Oggie » Mon Apr 29, 2013 1:32 am

Hey XL,

This is a super exciting cartridge that I have been avidly following for a while now. Was scheduled to launch in March 2013 in the US - has that happened ? Despite my best efforts its unlikely to be available in NZ till 2014 - what a shame ! There's not a great deal on it on You Tube either in terms of penetration tests etc. There's a bit of data around trajectory and wind impact though. The real test will be game impact ! Cannot wait to own one !

Cheers,

Oggie

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Re: A new Rimfire cartridge

Post by Grumpy » Mon Apr 29, 2013 2:34 am

I hadn`t heard a dickeybird about this one Dev. Shows how out-of-touch I am.
Didn`t I tell you not to be specific re calibres ? ie, .22 rimfire NOT .22 lr ? 7mm NOT 7x57 ?
Ah well, you live and learn - I had to. Getting another variation or a change is a pain in the ar*e however.
It isn`t the police that refuse it`s use on deer - that`s down to legislation..... even though this calibre will be adequate for head shots on deer up to Roe. The refusal to allow the use of .22 CF calibres on Roe in England and Wales is ridiculous.
Like the .17 HMR this should work very well with moderators .... although it`ll need something a little more effective than an SAK .... but not a lot more as the amount of gas produced won`t be huge.
Make a man a fire and he`ll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he will be warm for the rest of his life.
( Terry Pratchett )

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Re: A new Rimfire cartridge

Post by Grumpy » Mon Apr 29, 2013 2:36 am

Should be superb for Foxing Dev !!
Make a man a fire and he`ll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he will be warm for the rest of his life.
( Terry Pratchett )

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Re: A new Rimfire cartridge

Post by xl_target » Mon Apr 29, 2013 4:06 am

Oggie wrote:Hey XL,

This is a super exciting cartridge that I have been avidly following for a while now. Was scheduled to launch in March 2013 in the US - has that happened ? Despite my best efforts its unlikely to be available in NZ till 2014 - what a shame ! There's not a great deal on it on You Tube either in terms of penetration tests etc. There's a bit of data around trajectory and wind impact though. The real test will be game impact ! Cannot wait to own one !

Cheers,

Oggie
Oggie,
I haven't seen hide nor hair of this.
I haven't seen either the guns or the ammo available anywhere locally.
“Never give in, never give in, never; never; never; never – in nothing, great or small, large or petty – never give in except to convictions of honor and good sense” — Winston Churchill, Oct 29, 1941

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Re: A new Rimfire cartridge

Post by Oggie » Mon Dec 02, 2013 2:29 pm

Hey XL

Any updates from your end on this caliber ? Usually there's a fair few reviews etc on You Tube but there's very little as yet there and none seems new. Was wondering if its now commercially and freely available in the US and what the general performance feedback is ? Technically the round sounds like its a path breaking innovation - a great rimfire with centrefire properties. I had thought that we'd see the round in NZ by end of this year but now it looks like there's no real date set yet. I almost bought a .22 Mag out of frustration the other day but then decided I'd wait a bit longer and not settle for second best !

Cheers,

Oggie

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Re: A new Rimfire cartridge

Post by Grumpy » Mon Dec 02, 2013 10:01 pm

The cartridges have been available for some time in the US ..... The only problem was delays with deliveries of the rifle which dragged behind the cartridges by some months. Situation at the moment seems to be that the ammo is fine but there have been several reports of reliability/accuracy problems associated with the rifle. Looks like the best policy is to wait until Savage have those problems sorted .....
Make a man a fire and he`ll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he will be warm for the rest of his life.
( Terry Pratchett )

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