Indians For Guns

goodboy_mentor wrote:Which is the most effective edged weapon for self defense or home defense? Please share your opinions with proper reasoning.

In my opinion, Katar(push dagger) is the most effective edged weapon for self defense, close combat or home defense because of the following reasons -

1. Going by the laws of physics, it can give the most powerful blow into your target, because the pointed edge is fully aligned with the direction of your forearm delivering the thrust(push).

2. You can use it in the shortest possible time. Just pull it out and instinctively punch it in the target. No need to waste your time swinging your arm around to gather momentum to give a slicing blow like with knife or a Khukri or short Kirpan. Think of a boxer giving a quick surprise blow to his opponent. The attack with a Katar will be something similar.

3. If required, you can also give powerful slicing blows or movements

4. It can be reasonably concealed

What is the second preferred edged weapon? It is Gandasa. Mentioned the reasons in the post represented by this link - viewtopic.php?t=23931#p236966 For those who do not know what is Gandasa or how does it look like, it's images are given in the posts represented by these links https://www.indiansforguns.com/viewtopi ... 68#p221999 and https://www.indiansforguns.com/viewtopi ... 68#p222053

Unless ones a trained boxer or martial artist a punchs not that instinctive in a fight I would think. Risk of fracture. A Katara not that easily available off the shelf gbm. A large and light blade perhaps which is not to cumbersome to yield effectively. Something like a machete, an "agricultural tool", large enough to maintain some distance, light enough to weild effectively and easily available too.

Regards
Moin.

You didn’t mention a spear. A very basic and effective edged tool. Mine are made from lawnmower blades or leaf springs, and use handles that are sold for rakes and shovels. Even a long handled spade shovel can be cut down to a point and sharpened to be a very effective spear.

Rudransh wrote:It may sound funny but after having a tons of Knifes both antique and modern best I find is ice breaker .It's strong small and very easy and eager to dive in any medium.

Regards
Veerbhadra

I agree. Most people think they need tactical tanto style or big khukris for self defence but to be honest most people nowadays hardly workout or go to martial arts classes required to use the weapon. The best way for such people is to carry a pen knife, ice pick, stiletto, screwdriver etc type of object that can achieve speed and maneuverability with ease. The idea is to defend from attacker not kill or hack the attacker to pieces. Although if a person has both power and skills then even a single punch at a particular point can cause it's attacker's death in mere seconds.

spyplayingcard wrote:You didn’t mention a spear. A very basic and effective edged tool. Mine are made from lawnmower blades or leaf springs, and use handles that are sold for rakes and shovels. Even a long handled spade shovel can be cut down to a point and sharpened to be a very effective spear.

Spear can neither be taken everywhere with yourself nor used inside most homes. However, it is a very very good choice for self defense in open space inside property. Sort of wave controller type weapon and keeps the attacker at a distance too.

Moin. wrote:

goodboy_mentor wrote:Which is the most effective edged weapon for self defense or home defense? Please share your opinions with proper reasoning.

In my opinion, Katar(push dagger) is the most effective edged weapon for self defense, close combat or home defense because of the following reasons -

1. Going by the laws of physics, it can give the most powerful blow into your target, because the pointed edge is fully aligned with the direction of your forearm delivering the thrust(push).

2. You can use it in the shortest possible time. Just pull it out and instinctively punch it in the target. No need to waste your time swinging your arm around to gather momentum to give a slicing blow like with knife or a Khukri or short Kirpan. Think of a boxer giving a quick surprise blow to his opponent. The attack with a Katar will be something similar.

3. If required, you can also give powerful slicing blows or movements

4. It can be reasonably concealed

What is the second preferred edged weapon? It is Gandasa. Mentioned the reasons in the post represented by this link - viewtopic.php?t=23931#p236966 For those who do not know what is Gandasa or how does it look like, it's images are given in the posts represented by these links https://www.indiansforguns.com/viewtopi ... 68#p221999 and https://www.indiansforguns.com/viewtopi ... 68#p222053

Unless ones a trained boxer or martial artist a punchs not that instinctive in a fight I would think. Risk of fracture. A Katara not that easily available off the shelf gbm. A large and light blade perhaps which is not to cumbersome to yield effectively. Something like a machete, an "agricultural tool", large enough to maintain some distance, light enough to weild effectively and easily available too.

Regards
Moin.

It is very happy to see you again Bro....

kshitij wrote:Never said it is unworthy, but the topic of discussion is "most effective edged weapon for self defense". The fact that a weapon can be held/wielded in only one way seems like a major limiting factor.

Yes it can be held in only one direction for a good reason. The reason is the laws of physics for penetrating the target. But it can also be wielded in multiple directions.

You can rapidly punch and pull it out to make multiple punches or hit another target.

You can punch and slice towards left or right or up or down to increase the damage.

You can also make only slicing movements if needed.

Since it was designed to punch through chainmail armor, it should also be able easily punch through a bullet proof vest.

Direction of the grip is such that it cannot slip through your hands even if they get a bit loose or are oily or slippery for some reason. On the other hand the handle/ hilt of most knives or similar weapons is such that if your grip gets loosened for some reason or hands are oily or slippery, chances of the handle/ hilt of knife or similar weapon slipping out from your hands are pretty high.

Earlier you had mentioned that if attacked from behind, you cannot use it backwards. If you curl your wrist a bit backwards, you can also hit backwards. But anyways when attacked from behind by someone who knows his job, the odds of escape or survival are pretty bleak(unless you are alert enough to escape a possible attack from behind before it is launched). Why? because he would simply hit the medula oblangata(located somewhere the lower hind part of skull and neck vertebrae join) very hard with a club like weapon and then smash or slice spinal cord, arteries in neck etc. Yes it is pretty nauseatingly grim and disgusting stuff but that is what the cold blooded killers do.

Still not convinced about the Katar. Personally, I would rather go with any of conventional handled weapons mentioned in this thread before going for the Katar

kshitij wrote:Still not convinced about the Katar. Personally, I would rather go with any of conventional handled weapons mentioned in this thread before going for the Katar

Of course certainly agree on this. Personal preference, comfort levels with the weapon in question as well ready commercial availability of the required weapon play an important part.

I would prefer a pair of double edged karambit...but then I have martial arts background too. In a close combat fight it's not often the technique, but the aggression and speed you show seea you through an winning outcome. Technical fight moves are best kept for martial art practice.

Great discussion guys! GBM has inspired me to do something in the Katar line..... Kshitij, what say?

By the way, I was thinking of another criterion, if I was to carry a knife for SD, shouldn't it be something which does not look obviously like a weapon? So that you gentlemen don't wake up one fine morning to see my ugly mug looking out at you from the newapaper's front page, underneath a heading like, "Deadly Terrorist arrested in Mumbai with home-made Katar".

sumanngon wrote:In a close combat fight it's not often the technique, but the aggression and speed you show seea you through an winning outcome

Very true, the level of aggression and speed are crucial. Your physical location in relation to your attackers and the element of surprise also matter. In the video below, a truck driver is able to save himself from a possible lynch mob due to his higher, relatively enclosed position and the element of surprise that included aggression, speed, and being armed with a long sword -


Those who are not aware of cowardly crowd behavior in many parts of the Indian sub continent, it is not uncommon for crowds to sometimes behave as savages, and kill the unarmed and helpless victim without any lawful cause or reason whatsoever. For example below mentioned news item illustrates the point -

Woman burnt to death near Jodhpur for protesting chopping of tree

A 28-year-old woman was burnt alive in her village near Jodhpur on Sunday allegedly for protesting the chopping of a tree.

Tension griped Hariyadhana village on Monday as locals assembled at the spot insisting that the accused including the sarpanch and a revenue official be arrested before cremating the body.

Station House Officer of Borunda police station Suresh Choudhary said Vidhyadhar, son of Om Prakash Brahmin lodged a complaint that his sister Lalita had protested the chopping of a tree near his field to build a road.

Around 10 people including sarpanch Ranveer Singh Champawat and a revenue official Omprakash then attacked her, poured petrol over her and set her on fire, her brother alleged. The 10 accused have been named in an FIR.

Lalita was rushed to a hospital in Jodhpur, 100 km away, later in the evening after primary medical aid at the government hospital in at Borunda village. She succumbed to burn injuries during treatment at hospital in Jodhpur late Sunday night.

The body was handed over to the family members after post-mortem.

When the body reached the village on Monday morning, angry locals began protesting and demanded the arrest of the accused.

Source http://www.hindustantimes.com/india-new ... J5znO.html

essdee1972 wrote:By the way, I was thinking of another criterion, if I was to carry a knife for SD, shouldn't it be something which does not look obviously like a weapon?

So long there is no Notification issued under Section 4 of Arms Act 1959 for the area, where "arm other than firearm" is found in your possession, you have nothing to worry from Arms Act 1959. But regardless of any Notification or the looks of knife in question, you will always have to worry about some corrupt police officers, who will pretend to be ignorant of law, so that you are compelled to make a choice, to either pay them a very hefty bribe under fear or actually get arrested to be sent to police lockup, under some false accusations and consequently suffer financially, mentally, physically, and needless to mention the instant loss of reputation in society.

Any knife, preferably a knife designed for combat. Indian Bichua if well made. Commando knives from reputed brands. Learn to use it before your EDC

Venki

There r many good pointed weapons Khukri ,peshkabaz ,Khyber , Jambya khanjar and solid Kirpan r running for no 1 slot in self defence.Khukri is very lethal basically part of Tegha sword,Peshkabaz is surprise but very dangerous capable of penetrating bulletproof jackets but hard to buy.Jmabya and Khyber r in same category khyber has same fuction like peshkabaz but is very long 2 feet .Jambya is very lethal I tried it on the coconet same cutting power of long sword with one stroke 4 parts same goes for pure solid kirpan .Then comes bichuwa ,survival dagger push dagger and katar.

I normally keep a folder. And at home I have a khukri at a strategic location near the door.

you will always have to worry about some corrupt police officers, who will pretend to be ignorant of law, so that you are compelled to make a choice, to either pay them a very hefty bribe under fear or actually get arrested to be sent to police lockup, under some false accusations and consequently suffer financially, mentally, physically, and needless to mention the instant loss of reputation in society.

Exactly what I worry about. Reminds of the time a copper tried to tell me that I was breaking the law by carrying MY dog in MY car. I managed to brazen it out. He probably bet on me getting scared, wasn't expecting someone with a little knowledge of law. Thanks IFG for that little knowledge!