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Air pistol for Self Defence

A posts related to self defence/ home defence. Please post anything related to legal aspects in the 'Legal Eagle' section.
autobot
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Air pistol for Self Defence

Postby autobot » Sun Dec 21, 2008 3:27 pm

A big hi to all the renowned and not-so-renowned shots here! :) This is my first post here.

Before the readers start laughing at my question, I confess that I've next to zero idea when it comes to guns (***all forms of hunting are now illegal in India - Moderator ***). But after the Mumbai attacks and general rise in crime elsewhere, I felt I've to find a means to defend myself in case the need arises. And since I'm not a black belt in any of the deadly arts, I decided that buying and learning to use a gun was the next best thing.

In view of the existing difficulties to obtain a license, I was hoping the purchase of an air pistol might serve the purpose. So here is my question :

"Is there an air pistol (which does not need a license) that can stop a man (in SD)?"



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Re: Air pistol for Self Defence

Postby fantumfan2003 » Sun Dec 21, 2008 6:02 pm

To answer your last line....

SHORT VERSION
===========

In one word.....NO !

LONG VERSION
==========

If you do end up wearing an air pistol on you.........you will either....

- RIP if you ever get mixed up with bad guys

- Have a tough time explaining to cops (if you are ever stopped for checking anywhere) why you are wearing a gun and why you don't have a license for it. They will choose to be ignorant and clueless, inspite of you taking pains to explain to them it does not require a license and its for self protection. I don't need to explain, why the cops will do that, do I ?

So either way, its a bad idea.

Manish







autobot\";p=\"62502 wrote:A big hi to all the renowned and not-so-renowned shots here! :) This is my first post here.

Before the readers start laughing at my question, I confess that I've next to zero idea when it comes to guns (the closest I ever got to one was when I went to hunt wild duck with an uncle - once). But after the Mumbai attacks and general rise in crime elsewhere, I felt I've to find a means to defend myself in case the need arises. Ands since I'm not a black belt in any of the eadly arts, I decided that buying and learning to use a gun was the next best thing.

In view of the existing difficulties to obtain a license, I was hoping the purchase of an air pistol might serve the purpose. So here is my question :

"Is there an air pistol (which does not need a license) that can stop a man (in SD)?"



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mundaire
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Postby mundaire » Sun Dec 21, 2008 6:55 pm

A) None of the air-pistols available in India have the required power to be viable for self-defence. Also, even if we assume for a moment that an air-pistol was able to produce the required power levels, it would automatically require an arms license (as it would fail the deal wood test).

B) It would be very dangerous to carry a replica pistol or an air-pistol for self defence.

Why? I think I have mentioned this in an earlier post on the self defence forum here, but will repeat it anyhow - lets say the attacker(s) on seeing the replica pistol/ air-pistol mistake it for the real thing. Now they must proceed on the assumption that you are armed with a firearm and would run away (this will happen in some cases) OR they will immediately and actively work towards neutralising the threat, which loosely translated means that they would shoot you.

On the other hand if the attackers recognise the replica/ air-pistol as not being a real firearm, they will proceed with their attack anyway.

On balance you would be better off without a replica/ air-pistol.

If you are planning to carry a firearm, be sure it is a real gun which shoots real bullets. The idea is to avoid confrontation as far as possible, but when faced with a situation where your/ your family's life is under threat, there is no means of escape and you have to pull out your firearm as a last recourse - you must be prepared and able to use it to good effect. Forget about shooting below the knees etc., you need to aim for the torso and try and put your attackers down before they can cause you/ your family any harm.

As you can see from the above, this would mean more than just buying a gun, you need to learn how to use it, which means you should also practice regularly. A hit with a .22 is better than a miss with a .45...

Cheers!
Abhijeet


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autobot
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Re: Air pistol for Self Defence

Postby autobot » Sun Dec 21, 2008 8:11 pm

Thanks for the prompt replies guys!
@ Mod: sorry ... honestly didnt know that :oops:

@Manish: The short version is def better! :D

@Abhijeet:I'd read the post you refered to, but since no one does the actual deal wood test, I wondered if there might be a way to circumvent the roadblocks by importing a foreign made powerful air pistol :twisted: . Does some model exist? In your reply you only mentioned Indian made pistols.

Thanks for the help mates!
Jeevan



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dev
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Postby dev » Sun Dec 21, 2008 8:43 pm

There are very powerful airpistols but none should be carried for self defense unless you have a death wish. And it has been said that your chances of being struck by lightening are higher than being shot by a terrorist.
So take your time and work on the firearm license you might even consider a shotgun for home defense.

dev


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Postby mundaire » Sun Dec 21, 2008 9:39 pm

autobot\";p=\"62522 wrote:@Abhijeet:I'd read the post you refered to, but since no one does the actual deal wood test, I wondered if there might be a way to circumvent the roadblocks by importing a foreign made powerful air pistol :twisted: . Does some model exist? In your reply you only mentioned Indian made pistols.


You seem to have missed the gist of what I was saying. Whether or not anyone comes knocking on your door to conduct the deal wood test is of no consequence, the fact is that if your airgun fails the test it is required to be entered on an arms license - this is a legal requirement, with no exceptions.

Knowingly purchasing an airgun that you know to have more power than is legal, is quite simply put - a crime. Please do not make posts here asking for assistance in committing/ planning to commit a crime, however insignificant you may feel it to be! This is against the rules of this board and you may consider this as an official warning.

Cheers!
Abhijeet
Last edited by mundaire on Sun Dec 21, 2008 9:48 pm, edited 2 times in total.


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autobot
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Re: Air pistol for Self Defence

Postby autobot » Sun Dec 21, 2008 9:46 pm

@dev: thanks for the advice, but well.. statistics dont convince me anymore :) But yes, it is indeed a unanimous respnonce that applying for a permit is the better of the two choices. So that's what I'll do. Nearest rifle club, here i come! :D

ps: decent quality shotgun vs decent hand gun - which is cheaper?



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raj
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Re: Air pistol for Self Defence

Postby raj » Sun Dec 21, 2008 9:56 pm

shotgun would be far more cheaper than handgun...you can pick a nice shotgun for around13-14k...(12gauge or 16gauge).handguns would be costlier...

regards
raj


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autobot
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Re: Air pistol for Self Defence

Postby autobot » Sun Dec 21, 2008 10:05 pm

@Abhijeet: I understand why the forum standards are to be maintained, but then again Indians are born with instincts to 'handle' irritating red tape :D . Hence the slip up. My bad.

A shot gun is cheaper than a hand gun?? :shock: .. thanks mate!



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Re: why airguns/ replicas are useless for self defence

Postby mundaire » Tue Feb 17, 2009 4:28 pm

For all those out there who think that carrying a replica/ blank firer/ air-pistol is a decent hassle free way to protect themselves (by scaring off attackers), please read the following:

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Citi ... 142536.cms

The chap who was shot dead, had apparently pulled out his handgun to "threaten" the other chap, confident (I assume) that the other fellow would not be armed. What happened next? Well, the other chap pulled out his own gun and shot him dead! Lessons to be learnt from this:

a) If you are going to pull out a gun, you better be doing so because you plan to use it
b) If you pull out a gun the chap in front of you WILL ASSUME that you plan to use it and react accordingly
c) Guns are not to be bandied about to "scare" someone into submission - you'll most likely either end up at the police station or the morgue

Cheers!
Abhijeet


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Sujay
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Re: why airguns/ replicas are useless for self defence

Postby Sujay » Tue Feb 17, 2009 5:22 pm

mundaire wrote:
The chap who was shot dead, had apparently pulled out his handgun to "threaten" the other chap, confident (I assume) that the other fellow would not be armed. What happened next? Well, the other chap pulled out his own gun and shot him dead! Lessons to be learnt from this:



But Abhijeet, from the story it appears that the victim was shot "before" he could reach for his Pistol. Apparently, both tried the same thing , one of them succeeded.


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Re: Air pistol for Self Defence

Postby nagarifle » Tue Feb 17, 2009 5:27 pm

the problem with air guns is as Abiji has said.

the question is are you prepared to kill? if that is why you said that you wanted a arms for "protection "
reason being if the answer is no then better not have arms. it will only become a hindrances.

in some area/locality it is better not to be armed. that way you can live long.

am learning the art of invisibility and bullets defying movements, it seems to work so far. ROTFL


Nagarifle

if you say it can not be done, then you are right, for you, it can not be done.

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Re: Air pistol for Self Defence

Postby mundaire » Tue Feb 17, 2009 5:32 pm

Sujay,

I'm reading between the lines here...

The situation unfolds like this -> the shooter beats up the victims driver -> driver calls up his boss -> boss & boss's Dad land up -> shooter is unimpressed by victim's (typical Delhi walla type) "do you know who I am?"/ "do you know who I know?" bluster -> victim pulls out his handgun to cow down the shooter -> shooter pulls his own gun out and pumps four into him.

Now, the shooter was a local village headman, the victim was a local industrialist... who's version of events do you think the cops would push forward? Victim's family would want "satisfaction" and any version that could allow the shooter to get away on a self-defence plea would surely be swept under the carpet...

Cheers!
Abhijeet


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Re: Air pistol for Self Defence

Postby kanwar76 » Tue Feb 17, 2009 6:06 pm

Man this is gun rights activist’s nightmare coming true. I am sure both guns were licensed. Another instance for antis to quote when lobbying for stricter gun laws :(

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Re: Air pistol for Self Defence

Postby mundaire » Tue Feb 17, 2009 6:23 pm

kanwar76 wrote:Man this is gun rights activist’s nightmare coming true. I am sure both guns were licensed. Another instance for antis to quote when lobbying for stricter gun laws :(

-Inder


Well, it really depends on what "spin" you give to it. If you think about it, the ONLY reason the victim would have felt confident in pulling out a gun to "scare" the shooter would have been because he felt confident that the other person was not armed - a direct by-product of our current (elitist) licensing and gun ownership policies.

If on the other hand the licensing policies were more even handed and gun prices (on the legal market) were more realistic, the victim would have almost certainly NOT taken this foolish step, as he would have no way of knowing if the other party was armed.... and he would probably be still breathing today.

In this sense, this case is quite similar to the Manu Sharma/ Jessica Lal shooting, that goon Manu Sharma pulled out his gun ONLY because he could be fairly certain about the fact that there was a very slim chance of the other party being armed, this along with the fact that our current system breeds these sort "self-entitled" brats who feel they are above the law and can literally get away with murder is what causes such tragedies, NOT wider legal gun ownership.

Cheers!
Abhijeet


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