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Teutonic Tupperware

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xl_target
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Teutonic Tupperware

Postby xl_target » Wed Jan 02, 2019 10:39 am

In 2007, the German company Carl Walther GmbH Sportwaffen of Ulm introduced a very light, compact striker fired pistol called the PPS (Polizei-Pistole Schmal / Police Pistol Slim). It is available in either 9×19mm Parabellum or .40 S&W chamberings. It is a slim, polymer framed weapon of similar size to the Walther PPK.
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Walther PPS

The Walther PPS is a short recoil-operated locked breech semi-automatic pistol that uses a modified Browning cam-lock system adapted from the Hi-Power pistol. The PPS has a glassfiber-reinforced polymer frame and steel slide assembly. It can be broken down into its main parts or field stripped with a take down catch without the help of tools. The mechanism is similar to the Walther P99. This is a striker fired pistol not a hammer fired pistol. It is a true single stack pistol with the corresponding slim grip. The slide is about an inch wide. Takedown is very similar to the Block.. er… Glock.

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PPS magazine release

When they initially came out, I tried one out and really liked it. However, the PPS had one feature that I didn’t care for and that was a magazine release. The PPS magazine release is a lever built into the bottom of the trigger guard, instead of a button behind the trigger guard. So, I decided to hold off as I have used the American style magazine release for so long that I would have to retrain considerably to use the European style mag release. Under extreme stress, trying to release the magazine might result in failure. This isn’t a big deal for a range or competition handgun but for a concealed carry pistol, it would be a big no-no.

One of the handguns that I carried quite often was my Ruger LC9. This was mostly because of the small size and low weight. I was very fond of the little handgun (I did a review on it here) and was reasonably accurate with it at seven to twenty yards. However, I could not shoot it very fast. I did not think it was a big deal till I shot it under a timer. The combination of trigger and sights on that pistol required a very deliberate release to get hist on the target.

Last fall, we had one of our club’s steel shoots that had a very low attendance so we were able to repeat the same course with several handguns. With my reflex sighted competition handgun, I was able to shoot the course in a little over 3.5 seconds. With my Sig P225 (review here), I was able to shoot the course in just under 7 seconds but with the Ruger LC9, it took over 13 seconds to have five assured hits. This was certainly not optimal, especially on a handgun that you might have use under stress to shoot multiple targets quickly.

You’re probably wondering what this has to do with the Walther PPS.
Well, read on McDuff and I will attempt to elucidate the matter.

In 2017, Walther redesigned the PPS and called it the PPS M2. It now had the American magazine release and the grip was contoured to resemble their PPQ family of pistols. It was offered with six, seven and eight round magazines. The original PPS is now called the PPS Classic. In late 2018, Walther offered the PPS M2 RMSc which came with the Shield RMSc mini reflex sight. The slide had cuts machined into it, which mounted the RMSc lower, allowing the pistol’s built in sights to be used in conjunction with the reflex sight. If the sight was damaged or the battery died, one could still use the factory iron sights to sight on a target. The Shield RMSc has no on/off switch but has a battery life of about three years. It stays on continuously but it dims in low light and brightens up when outdoors.

Last fall, I sold my Ruger LC9 and bought a PPS M2 RMSc. So far I’m favorably impressed. It has been 100 percent reliable with both FMJ and hollow points. Even though it has a tiny 3.18 inch long barrel, it is remarkably accurate. In fact, with the RMSc sight it is phenomenally accurate. I’ve put about 500 trouble free rounds through it. Many small pistols are a little more difficult to shoot but the PPS shoots like a much bigger handgun.

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The pistol comes in a blue plastic case with the Walther logo emblazoned on the front.

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Walthers label with their nomenclature on it

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The pistol comes with magazines, manual, and the tools for zeroing the RMSc sight.

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Three different views of the handgun

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With the six round magazine

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With the seven round magazine. This allows me all three fingers on the grip and is the way I carry it.

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With the 8 round magazine. This makes the grip the same as a full size pistol.

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With all three magazines

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Six rounds at 21 ft

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Eight rounds at 30 ft

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Six rounds at 45 ft.

These were shot when I first started shooting the pistol.
Now that I’ve shot it a bit more, I’m able to keep the fliers to a minimum and the groups are a lot tighter.
The trigger trips at about six pounds and has a crisp release with a very short positive reset.

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I found a holster maker who makes a holster, specific to the model, which encloses and protects the RMSc sight very nicely.


“Never give in, never give in, never; never; never; never – in nothing, great or small, large or petty – never give in except to convictions of honor and good sense” — Winston Churchill, Oct 29, 1941

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ckkalyan
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Re: Teutonic Tupperware

Postby ckkalyan » Mon Jan 07, 2019 12:58 pm

Teutonic indeed, XL!! What a neat piece of engineering?!

Great write up, as usual! Thanks!

I would love to see some of these cute, short barreled handguns thar are not allowed here in Canada. No carry is allowed! Maybe, I could fire a few test shots off this beauty on my next visit to MN.

Enjoy and keep us updated.


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Re: Teutonic Tupperware

Postby Vikram » Tue Jan 08, 2019 3:10 am

Very nice little pistol, XL. Congratulations! So many practical features. Those groups you shot are scarily tight! I can see its practicality. Thank you for sharing the review here.

Best-
Vikram


It ain’t over ’til it’s over! "Rocky,Rocky,Rocky....."


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Re: Teutonic Tupperware

Postby AgentDoubleS » Tue Jan 08, 2019 9:50 pm

Excellent review as always xl_target - thanks for taking the time out to share these reviews with us. Safe shooting with that nice little package you’ve got.

I read about Glock’s MOS line some days back - would it be fair to say reflex sights seem to be gaining popularity on SD guns.

Cheers,
SS

P.s- I’ve started shooting police pistol and PPC 1500 competitions but more on that in a separate thread.



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Re: Teutonic Tupperware

Postby Vikram » Tue Jan 08, 2019 11:55 pm

AgentDoubleS wrote:P.s- I’ve started shooting police pistol and PPC 1500 competitions but more on that in a separate thread.


Very interesting, AgentDoubleS. Do share your experiences.


It ain’t over ’til it’s over! "Rocky,Rocky,Rocky....."

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Re: Teutonic Tupperware

Postby xl_target » Wed Jan 09, 2019 5:11 am

Thanks CK.
Of course, it will be waiting for you when you come over again.
As you say, a neat piece of engineering. The fit and finish is excellent. There is not a single machining mark visible anywhere. The slide is Tenifer (a Salt Bath Nitriding process) coated to resist corrosion.

What do you mean; they don’t allow short barreled pistols in Canada?
What are the minimum barrel lengths allowed?

Thanks Vikram,
This pistol does allow the ability to place shots very precisely and is easy to shoot fast.
I picked it up after our competition shooting season ended last year so I haven’t had a chance to try it on the clock. Unlike a rifle with a red dot sight, where a cheek weld assures that the dot is easily picked up, many people have issues finding the dot, on a pistol, or losing the dot after the first shot. However, over that last couple of years, I have been shooting our club matches almost exclusively with a pistol that has an RDS mounted on it so I am reasonably confident in my abilities with that setup.
Another item that I should mention is that this pistol doesn’t have conventional cut rifling in the barrel. It has Polygonal Rifling.

SS,
let us know more about your PPC events.

A friend of mine bought a Glock MOS and quickly sold it. I shot it too and was not impressed. The issue is that if you want to compete with it, you have to change out the trigger as the standard Glock trigger leaves something to be desired. You then have to change out the plastic sights. If you mount a reflex sight on it, then you have to get suppressor sights if you want to have backup sights. The price can add up very quickly. It’s not a bad gun once it is setup properly but you've almost doubled the price by the time you get there.

An out of the box handgun that is setup for competition from the start is the Canik TP9 SFx.
It is very accurate, has plates for several brands of reflex sights, a 20 round magazines, a great trigger, a five inch barrel and dead reliable.
We're talking 2" - 2.5" groups at 25 yards and a 8"-10" plate at 100 yards Is no sweat. it's a lot of gun for the money.
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I'll do a review one of these days.


“Never give in, never give in, never; never; never; never – in nothing, great or small, large or petty – never give in except to convictions of honor and good sense” — Winston Churchill, Oct 29, 1941

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Re: Teutonic Tupperware

Postby Vikram » Wed Jan 09, 2019 7:20 pm

Thanks for link to polygonal rifling, XL. I read a long time ago and almost forgot about it. The pricing of this pistol is also a bargain considering how much one saves by avoiding the after market upgrades.

I looked up the Canik TP9 SFx. At $550, a steal practically. A quarter of the price of CZ custom shop race pistols. Would love to read your review of it. Whenever you have the time and inclination to do it, of course.


It ain’t over ’til it’s over! "Rocky,Rocky,Rocky....."

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Re: Teutonic Tupperware

Postby xl_target » Thu Jan 10, 2019 4:53 am

Vikram,
Those high end CZ pistols are really nice. One of my friends has a CZ Shadow 2. It is a very nice pistol; good looking, nice trigger and accurate. However, at $1300 MSRP, it a bit to much for my wallet. The base model of the Canik TP9 SFx, which is available for $476 (sans optics), will give it a run for its money on the range.
The Canik TP9 SFx is basically a copy of the Walther PPQ M2 Q5 Match but at a significantly lower price.
I've run the Q5 Match (I was thiiiiis close to buying one) but I'd wager my Canik has a better trigger. It also has a 20 round capacity vs 15 for the Walther. The Canik magazines, made by Mecgar, are cheaper than the Walther magazines. I like the Warren Tactical sights (that come from the factory on the Canik) for shooting steel better than the sights that come on the Walther. We have a guy who shoots the Q5 at our club and he spent another $100+ for an after market trigger. I think my Canik still has a more predictable trigger.


“Never give in, never give in, never; never; never; never – in nothing, great or small, large or petty – never give in except to convictions of honor and good sense” — Winston Churchill, Oct 29, 1941

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Re: Teutonic Tupperware

Postby Rover solomon » Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:57 am

Benchmark ...for ..how we need post the reviews
Nice



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Re: Teutonic Tupperware

Postby Vikram » Thu Jan 10, 2019 3:42 pm

xl_target wrote:Vikram,
Those high end CZ pistols are really nice. One of my friends has a CZ Shadow 2. It is a very nice pistol; good looking, nice trigger and accurate. However, at $1300 MSRP, it a bit to much for my wallet. The base model of the Canik TP9 SFx, which is available for $476 (sans optics), will give it a run for its money on the range.
The Canik TP9 SFx is basically a copy of the Walther PPQ M2 Q5 Match but at a significantly lower price.
I've run the Q5 Match (I was thiiiiis close to buying one) but I'd wager my Canik has a better trigger. It also has a 20 round capacity vs 15 for the Walther. The Canik magazines, made by Mecgar, are cheaper than the Walther magazines. I like the warren Tactical sights for shooting steel better than the sights that come on the Walther. We have a guy who shoots the Q5 at our club and he spent another $100+ for an after market trigger. I think my Canik still has a more predictable trigger.


I am always looking for bargains and the Canik sounds like a bargain. Why pay thrice more when it works almost as well! :wink: I don't know how they manage to produce such good guns at such prices.

Will definitely look forward to your review sometime.

Best-
Vikram


It ain’t over ’til it’s over! "Rocky,Rocky,Rocky....."

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Re: Teutonic Tupperware

Postby AgentDoubleS » Mon Jan 14, 2019 3:40 am

xl_target wrote:Vikram,
Those high end CZ pistols are really nice. One of my friends has a CZ Shadow 2. It is a very nice pistol; good looking, nice trigger and accurate.


The research I did showed up some great feedback for the CZ Shadow 2 and I almost went ahead and ordered it. Its over GBP1500 IF one can manage to get their hands on one. The Sig X5 was the other pistol I considered which I quite enjoyed borrowing and shooting. Both unfortunately were not as suited to PPC 1500 which is what I'm focussing on for now.

Back on topic - The Canik TP9 Sfx looks like ALOT of gun for the money! I'd not even heard of one till now. Will wait for the review.

Cheers
SS



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Re: Teutonic Tupperware

Postby ckkalyan » Mon Jan 14, 2019 10:10 am

xl_target wrote:Thanks CK.
Of course, it will be waiting for you when you come over again.
As you say, a neat piece of engineering. The fit and finish is excellent. There is not a single machining mark visible anywhere. The slide is Tenifer (a Salt Bath Nitriding process) coated to resist corrosion.

What do you mean; they don’t allow short barreled pistols in Canada?
What are the minimum barrel lengths allowed?


Thanks, xl_target for the invite!

The minimum barrel length for handguns is +105 mm (+4.133 inches)


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Re: Teutonic Tupperware

Postby xl_target » Wed Jan 16, 2019 9:45 pm

Take down and cleaning

Taking down a Walther PPS is very simple
Remove the magazine and check that the handgun is unloaded.

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Pull the trigger and then pull down on the take down buttons and the slide comes right off.

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Remove the recoil spring and the barrel comes off.
Above you can see the striker blocking mechanism. There is a cutout in the striker that the steel striker blocking pin sits in. When the trigger is pulled all the way back, the trigger bar pushes the pin up and allow the striker to move forward and strike the primer. So even if you drop the handgun, it cannot go off
This is the extent of disassembly.

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Now clean the barrel with a bronze brush and powder solvent.
Wipe everything down and reassemble the firearm.

For a handgun to feed well, it must have a way to feed bullets into the chamber easily and surely. This is usually accomplished with a feed ramp. However, a feed ramp that is too long might cause issues on its own as it might get in the way as the barrels unlocks and tips up.
This is a small pistol and there is not much room in the mechanism for an extended feed ramp. Walther solved this issue with a two piece feed ramp. One half in built into the bottom of the barrel and the other half is built into the frame.
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The feed ramp on the barrel

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The feed ramp in the frame.

In the, approximately 500+ rounds that I have run through the handgun since last fall, I have not experienced a single failure to feed fire or eject.


“Never give in, never give in, never; never; never; never – in nothing, great or small, large or petty – never give in except to convictions of honor and good sense” — Winston Churchill, Oct 29, 1941

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Re: Teutonic Tupperware

Postby AgentDoubleS » Sat Jan 19, 2019 2:38 pm

I’ve read more about the PPS/PPQ and the Canik in the last few days- excellent reviews for both firearms. In fact a day after your post a Canik Tp9 SFX post and discussion came up in my Facebook feed from one of the forums!! Coincidence or Mark Zuckerberg spying on us, not sure.

I’ll have to track the firearms you own more closely, xl. You do your research before you pull the trigger, excuse the bad pun!

How many rounds/times do you shoot before you clean your handguns?

Cheers
SS




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