Windows 10 Consumer Preview

[soul]

This is a must see, this is a new Microsoft and Satya Nadella is doing great!
http://www.microsoft.com/microsoft-hololens/en-us

Full webinar recording at
http://news.microsoft.com/windows10story/

It is a significant milestone to have single OS running on all form factors, with unified application development and highly productive features.
Not to mention, free upgrades till the lifetime of the hardware. Basically on its way to become the biggest ecosystem player in the market.

[timmy]

This is a hairy business for Microsoft. They are cannibalizing their OS market for the near future in giving Windows 10 away free for the next year in a bet to tie users into the Microsoft app store, which they realize they need to have in order to make Windows viable long term.

Nobody, especially in the business world, was in a hurry to move from XP to Vista, for obvious reasons. Many business users did go for Windows 7, but Windows 8 has laid an egg, as few are moving to it.

So, this is Microsoft's big gamble to salvage their stake in the enterprise market. It will be interested to see if it plays out for them.

We have 3 copies of Windows 7 running at our home, but our main machines are a pair of Macs running OS X 10.10. One Mac (mine) has one of the copies of Windows 7 on it. I also have a copy of XP running, but this is going to get dumped for a Raspberry Pi soon, so none of my machines has a critical need to upgrade -- I don't want Microsoft's app store or any of their subscription candy, since OS X is the main system for both of us.

I also note that Satya was promising that there'd be no free software from Microsoft, and now he has turned around and done it. Things must be at an interesting turn for him to make a strategic U turn like this.

[soul]

Not sure what you mean by salvage enterprise market, they still rule it with any scale. With regards to providing OS free with the device, along with upgrades its not different than what Apple is doing. The low cost devices is where it started taking hit from Android and Chrome, and the decision is strategic for the ecosystem. Having one OS, with free updates ensures a large and easily accessible ecosystem available for developers which goes from phones, tablets, pcs, Xbox & now Halolens.
I also don't subscribe to any software yet, but prefer single ecosystem. In my case it is all Windows, and now it looks like there is no need to buy anything from Apple.

[timmy]

What I mean by salvaging the enterprise market is, why should enterprise upgrade to Windows 10? Vista was a bust and the big deal about the ten year expiration of XP support was that so many enterprise users had not gone for Vista (I wonder why?) and only recently began migrating to Windows 7. Then Microsoft came out with Windows 8, which has generally laid an egg like Vista in the enterprise world.

The only way Microsoft can get users to move to Windows 10 (note that they skipped "9" -- why? Were they so desperate to compete against OS X that they had to jump a number for appearance's sake?) is to give it away for free, and if they want to tie users to an App Store like Apple has tied Mac users, this is the only way to do it. Then again, consider how much Microsoft has tried to parrot Apple (still listening to a Zune, anyone?) and how well it has worked out lately, one can hardly help but question whether this Microsoft move will fly. That's why I see it as a gamble.

Regarding market share, yes, Microsoft has a huge installed base. What does this mean? What did it mean to Compaq, IBM, Dell, Gateway, and so many others? Not very much, as only a few years made a world of difference in this market share business.

Back in 2001, I worked on a project with a team of about 50 IT contractors. I was the only one using a Mac -- it had then-new OS X on it. Continually I was razzed about Apple's market share, and about Michael Dell's advice to Steve Jobs regarding how he should have just broken Apple up and paid off the shareholders. Before that project was over, Dell was already going down the tubes, having offshored both their enterprise and consumer customer care. IT departments began a big move away from Dell then. Also, Dell's products came with defective electrolytic capacitors, and many businesses went elsewhere. Puerto Rico even sued Dell over their defective products. So now, Dell is a has been in the IT world and Apple is huge -- I wonder if Michael Dell is laughing still?

But the issue is, Apple has not shown strong interest in the enterprise market. They've made more in other markets. Microsoft is the one who continually tries to move into Apple's markets as their long term prospects for high profits from their enterprise markets keep shrinking. They no longer have the bulk to be able to buy their new technologies as they used to, and their own attempts to launch consumer products have been laughable "me too" flops all too often.

Sure, Apple has been giving away their OS X on new systems, along with iOS. So what? They make the hardware too, and the profit margins Apple makes on all of their stuff speaks for itself. Apple just announced more record profits, and Microsoft is struggling to keep up. Follow the money, you can see who's doing what.

[soul]

Sorry, I misread the intent. So question is not about salvaging but getting folks to upgrade to Windows 10. IMHO, it is more function of upgrade cycles within Enterprises which are usually 3 to 5 years minimum. I don't think they are scared of OSX at all, it has stuck in few % market share for decades and only now showing signs of crossing the 10% mark. If you think Enterprises will find it easy to move from Windows 7 to OSX instead of Windows 10 that will be shocking. The industry had challenge adapting from start menu to start screen, and this is a totally different OS and ecosystem. The challenge actually may come from Android & Chrome, who knows.

Apple has been very successful no denial of it, and very profitable due to full control on the all aspects of the device and in some way overhyped products and die hard fans. They will be profitable, but as you rightly said they don't compete in Enterprises in full extend and they probably will never get into Office, SharePoint, Exchange, Azure, etc. The flops you are talking about are reality of the industry, all companies have them including Apple (Lisa, Newton) and in most cases is wrong timing. Also the leaders are humans and make wrong decisions now and then. All said and done there will be always followers for some platform over the others, some find OSX better than Windows and others vice versa.

The next decade is certainly going to be interesting, lots of disruptive things going to happen.

[StampMaster]

There is a lot of buzz in the OS community to squeeze out the last paisa from the enterprise and individuals. Windows lags behind in this war where the biggest market share is for Win 7 in PC and Android in Mobile. Microsoft is planning to sync both pc and mobile together so they have come up with win 8 and now 10.

Win 8 is a bog flop therefore, they are they are selling it bundled with hardware. There was or is no reason for MS to release 8 then and now 10. But to grab market share and the free upgrade to Win 10 is just a catch. Why does a public traded company after so many years provided you their new OS for free upgrade or distribute free (ITS NOT OPEN SOURCE) and even if they do, it will be because of a motive to make money by big data selling info and commercials.

I have used the first preview of Vista, Win 7 and Win8 and win 8 to be worse. And if you had to do all the learning win 8 and 10 why not learn to use Linux which is free to use and from malware and other proprietary restrictions. It is very easy to use once you start using and never hangs or needs any maintenance. And importantly it is community developed not my organization which has hidden agenda to make money and keep their investors happy.

[soul]

Looks like the world does not support this view at all. If adapting from Start Menu to Start Screen is more difficult than moving from Windows 7 to Linux then Linux would be ruling the desktop world and not stuck at few % market. The problem is we are getting reviews about Windows 8 from people who have never even used it for some period of time. It has full backward compatibility to Windows 7 (the desktop is Windows 7) and its just plain whining about it. The OS is better than Windows 7, and the Start Screen makes it touch friendly as well. Now with Windows 10, you get best of both worlds, so hopefully less whining around the Start Menu and Start Screen. fyi, there is not software in the world that needs zero maintenance. If you think Linux developers are god and never make mistakes, just check the vulnerability database. Its just 2% market share, and more technical user makes it a less attractive target for malware writers. Its easy to fool non-techy users to click and run programs, it is the weakest link in security.

[timmy]

No, the question is about salvaging, I'm afraid. Microsoft has an aging market base in enterprise, where tons of Office, Windows, and other licenses would be purchased. However, there really isn't much more most users need in these programs. Some are nice to have, but paying the fees for upgrading to get these incremental abilities is not what a lot of enterprises are doing.

People were up in arms about the expiration of XP support, because so many enterprise and consumer customers still use it. Many folks I know, including myself, find it much easier to use for the work we do. Vista did not impress and Windows 7 was rolled out. 7 works, but in enterprise networks, IT managers don't just run down to Best Buy to pick up the software. New software must be tested for compatibility first, and in some enterprises, the upgrade to Windows 7 had not been started or completed before 8 came out -- to a not very welcome reception.

Will enterprise want Windows 10? I tend to doubt it. The move is made toward consumers and yet again, it is another "me too" Microsoft move to tie users of Windows to products like Apple offers.

The difference here is that OS X and iOS are only a part of the Apple market -- they serve to tie products together so that the Mac user can seamlessly move about between the iPhone, iPad, iMac, cloud, App Store, and iTunes, among other products. Windows 10 may offer some of this functionality, but it simply doesn't have Apple's installed market base. It is the reverse of what people used to say: Everyone bought Microsoft products because Microsoft had a full suite of compatible apps for the Windows environment. Now, people spend more time with a phone or iPad -- and it is Apple that has the big slice of that pie.

Wait a minute, you say -- I hear you quoting market share -- who cares about it? Apple doesn't. They don't aspire to be the next Microsoft or the largest smart phone maker. What they want is to dominate the high end products where the large revenue margins are found. Other companies make more phones, and they also make some pretty capable smart phones. So what? There are enough folks ready to plunk down the money to buy iPhones because they want the features, the apps, and the other aspects of what the product offers -- yes, even the snob value. Apple makes a lot of money on that, too.

Apple sees all of this as a parts to an overall strategy, something Jobs saw when he was out in the wilderness after Scully kicked him out into the street. Jobs did work with Pixar and got to know the entertainment industry, among other things. He saw the possibilities.

He also saw the way to go for OSs.

When Microsoft was a vassal of IBM, the old DOS OSs (which is everything up to Windows ME) were growing long in the tooth. A new direction was needed and IBM brought over some folks from DEC who developed VAX/VMS. When Microsoft split the sheets with IBM over the direction this new OS was to take, this development became IBM OS/2 and Windows NT. It is still the bones of your Windows 10 today.

DEC and IBM and Microsoft are large, capable companies, but together they are hardly a pimple compared to the old Bell Labs, which for many years was the world's premier research and development facility. (Think "transistor," but that's just a small part of Bell Labs's contributions to technology.) From Bell Labs came UNIX. When Jobs, out in the wilderness, wanted to base a new OS on the "Rolls Royce" of OSs, his obvious choice was UNIX. In typical Jobs fashion, he crafted an intuitive GUI for UNIX and called the result BeOS for his NEXT computing products. I first saw these working on a project in 1991. They ran on Intel 486s (new then) and they were light years ahead of anything else. They did video, they did audio -- they did it all.

Finally, over at Apple, the bean counters ran their course, and the company famously reached out to Jobs. Most think it was for his expertise and that was part of it. But another big part of it was that the old 68K based Mac OS was gasping for air, and Apple knew it needed a shot in the arm quickly. That shot in the arm was BeOS, which became OS X. I will tell you, I sure hate fooling with clunky and arcane registry entries, which I have to do at work, but sure don't mess with at home using my Macs.

But Jobs was not tied to computers. He foresaw the day when few people would spend much time messing with computers, and that day has arrived. While all of the techno-geeks kept crying for more power and more features, the market didn't go their. It went to iPads and smart phones. Jobs partly saw what people wanted and partly convinced them that they wanted what he thought they should have. Whether he was right or not, and whether Ballmer was right or not, you can judge for yourself.

I don't foresee OS X overtaking Windows. I doubt that Apple cares very much if it ever even comes close, because they are not in business to have the highest market share. The name of the game in business is MONEY, not obscure data. OS X forms a part of their strategy to talk the money out of people's pockets and into their coffers, and right now it is doing a great job of that. Whether that's something you want to root for or against is not my business. I only care about what makes sense for me, and as long as I have the means, I choose to pay the extra money and get the intuitive elegance, the reliability, and the enjoyment of using Apple products.

I will admit that I have been very unamused at the latest iterations of iOS. It has been very buggy and, unlike my previous habits, I've learned to upgrade only after the complaints die away. For iOS 8, they finally did. I upgraded my old iMac to OS X 10.10 and it worked great, but now I have a new iMac running the same at it is great -- no problems at all, and the hardware is quite good.

As far as Linux is concerned, it too is a derivative of UNIX. And, it powers a lot more of the essential underpinnings in the computer world than your 2% figure would reflect. Will it overtake Windows? I seriously doubt it. Again, besides a few, nobody is interested in fooling with computers anymore, like they were decades ago when PCs took the country by storm. People have moved on from that. But I will guarantee you that every time you make a cell phone call, you are going through Linux systems, because that's what the cell phone network manufacturers like Ericsson and Nokia use as the guts of their switches. Linux ain't going away anytime soon, and UNIX is still the bedrock of computing, just like it has been for decades.

As for Windows, the issue is, can Microsoft integrate it into a panoply of products that ties users to it in the same way that Apple has? Well, Microsoft has come very late to the game and, like so many of their "me too" products, it is trying to capitalize on products and markets that are already mature over at Apple. While Satya is trying to figure out how best to "me too" Apple, I suspect that R&D over at Cupertino is several years down the road, planning the next moves.

I don't much care whether Windows flies or not, myself. I don't see myself moving on for many years beyond the Windows 7 systems I have at home (until a few years ago, I still ran my home backroom systems on Windows 2000. (In fact, my old Compaq Proliant 7000 won't work on anything beyond that, because billg saw fit to cut Pentium Pro multiprocessor support from 2003 Server.) My only day to day connection with Windows is at work, and I'm sure that there, Windows 10 will not be part of the near future.

[soul]

They never lost in desktop to salvage any share back, so not sure what is the point here. Also, along with Windows, Office, SharePoint, Exchange are the industries top applications and not one of the products has seen the downward trend since their release. The market is changing overall, so all companies are adapting as necessary. Each company went through its own cycles of failures and successes, and the bottom line is we end up using products that work for us. It is Apple for some, Windows for some and Linux for some. Looking at this thread, all seem to have their own favorites and holding on to their positions