Indians For Guns

Yeah Rottlord, even I have dreams of some of those thingies. However mine is more near a Ruger Single Six or a Vanquero in handguns. Maybe some day...


Dev

David,

Buying a blank firing gun for self defense is a very bad idea.

In anycase I doubt you would find anything in your price range. My guess is you're probably missing a zero in your budget.

MoA wrote:David,

Buying a blank firing gun for self defense is a very bad idea.

In anycase I doubt you would find anything in your price range. My guess is you're probably missing a zero in your budget.

david

thats true

u are missing a zero

Besides, there is no arms dealer in Kol that sells a BF Gun. They haven't even have an idea of such things to be existing. What do people think about this?

http://www.securityarms.com/20010315/ga ... 0/2816.htm

David, pls visit:

me-sportwaffen.de

See the stuff there; I also asked one of my lawyer friends on what could be done to get one imported.

Regards,

Rottlord

-- Mon Jun 29, 2009 16:51 --

I found out about rubber bullets; they are just rubber projectiles on regular live cartridges. So, rule out the possibilities.

talk2devid wrote:hi all.........

in my previous post...i've mentioned that...i'm going to purchase a blank firing gun. can anybody suggest me ...in kolkata (West Bengal) From Where i can buy the gun??? also please suggest me the good product between 4000-5000 INR??? (It May be In Chaina Or Some Other Country Make)... I'just Need Some Fire And Sound...(And Optionally It May Through Bullets)...

Waiting for Reply.

Best Regards
David

Please refrain from using the blood red colour. Secondly, you will have to try to import the blank firing gun yourself and run the gauntlet. I don't think that anyone on the board has imported one, which is why you aren't getting the answer that you are looking for. There are Beretta 92F and loads of other blank firing replicas so do a google search for them or check pyramyd air. And then bite the bullet and order one, if it comes in write about it on the board .

Dev

oh yaar ! you need to protect yourself with toy gun .......
u should get Co2 pistol it will look like original & u they r quite powerfull \& no license is needed
try at www.airgundepot.com

We just had a local judge go through a scary incident with a revolver loaded with blanks yesterday. Evidently he was training with some city official in some scheme where the judge played the role of a hostage. The trainee shot him in the head with a blank gun. The judge was rushed to the hospital. They had him on TV tonight and his forehead looked pretty burned, but thank goodness his eyes were not damaged.

One has to wonder about the judge, however: Playing around with a firearm is just plain stupid, and my own personal belief is that the man isn't qualified to even own a firearm, much less be a judge.

Several years ago, we had the case of a minister in a church who was commenting during a service that being without religion was like playing russian roulette. He put a gun loaded with blanks to his head and pulled the trigger. The damage to his skull and brain resulted in his death.

That people don't realize that even blanks do not make firearms safe for use as toys is just plain shocking. I don't think that blank-loaded devices are safe to wave around as threats, either.

However, the idea of using one as a personal defense weapon, or even of using an air or CO₂ pistol as a defense weapon, is an extremely unwise decision.

Timmy, since u have an exposure more to the co2 pistols than most of us here, I'm bringing it under your notice. I recently came across the pellets called the Gamo Rocket (http://www.pyramydair.com/s/p/Gamo_Rock ... _150ct/423) and the Gamo PBA Armor .177 Cal, 6.8 Grains, Domed (http://www.pyramydair.com/s/p/Gamo_PBA_ ... d_80ct/594) made from a specially designed ballistic alloy and with a steel ball as the tip. The pellets are claimed to travel at a speed that's 30% more than that of a regular pellet and also has a deeper penetration and expansion capability. Now, given that a Beretta co2 .177 shoots at 425 ft/sec normally with RWS wadcutter or similar other pellets, the Gamo Rocket / Armor mathematically, shall travel at (425 + 127.5) = 552.5 ft/sec. The original Beretta 92FS 9 mm has a muzzle velocity of 1200 feet or 365 meters/second, which is, a little more than double of what my calculation with the co2 version and the Rocket pellets. Besides, ours is a warm country (this summer, the temp at Kolkata was 41.2 degrees C), which, I believe shall also have some effect on the thrust produced by the co2.

Now, taking everything under consideration (including the lesser weight of the projectile), would a CO2 gun have enough power, at least, to incapacitate an attacker through blunt trauma from a distance of 10 or 15 ft?

-- Wed Jul 01, 2009 16:05 --

A small review I read a couple of minutes back; could someone let me know about how authentic is the info that has been presented?

Post no. 19 (http://www.reviewcentre.com/review10663.html)

shotman. on 7th Dec 2002

de-bunker - I have been shooting guns for 8 years, so i know what i am taking about. I shoot my 92fs at 20 yards against steel traps the wadcutters do EXPEND quite a bit i have got the proof. 400fps is powerful if you think about it. Pellets go into wood (GO IN ABOUT 5MM) at 20 yards and I have shot against heavy clothes (7 yards) and guess what!! They go right through and still hit the trap so if i was to shoot you in the chest at close range (7-10m) do you really think you just get a way with red mark? It will go into the body (not right though or anything) but it will. The government says that it only takes 200fps to penetate the body. So what you know more then firarm experts. (go to homeoffice.co.gov and look for the fcc report on firarms. Further more people have been shot in the head with these gas guns and have nearly died. So you see i have researched and done tests. (shot at heavy/clothing at 7 yards against wood / brick at 7 and 20 yards) glass at 4 and 7 yards I have shot at 50 yards I have got the target to prove it, and if you read the booklet it says that it is "capable of firing a pellet at over 400 yards' GET THE BOOKLET AND SEE FOR YOURSELF.

Rottlord, I cannot recall the last time I shot a CO₂ handgun or rifle, however:

A .22 LR is considered very marginal for self defense. Admittedly, assassins have used the .22 in handguns, but remember that bullet placement is vital when using any weapon in any caliber, but it is even more essential when using a low power cartridge like the .22 Note that the assassin has much more choice in the matter of bullet placement, but in a self defense situation, the person is reacting, not choosing their shooting situation.

The ballistics of the marginal .22 LR out of a 6" barrel are: a 40 gr bullet at 1150 fps, 117 foot pounds of energy.

Consider: one of the pellets you listed weighs 9.6 gr. This is 1/4 of the weight of the .22 LR, so you must subtract 3/4 of the energy of the .22 LR when using this pellet.

Then consider: When figuring energy of the bullet, velocity is not linear, it is geometric. In other words, energy is squared and since your pellet is traveling at about 1/2 the speed of the .22 LR, you have only 1/4 of the energy of the remaining quarter you had left after considering the weight difference.

In other words the energy of a 9.6 gr bullet traveling at 500 fps is 5.3 foot pounds -- not a lot, is it?

Energy means the ability to destroy vital tissue and the ability to penetrate the body to get access to vital tissues, including bone and muscle. If 117 foot pounds of energy is considered marginal, how do you imagine that 5.3 foot pounds is sufficient?

Granted, it may break the skin. It might even burrow under the skin to some extent. But will it reach the heart or penetrate bone to reach a vital organ, and then deliver enough destruction to save your life? What if it hits a button or something in a pocket? What if the attacker has a bulky coat? In other words, how reliable is this -- how much can you depend on it to get the job done?

Now, put yourself in the position of the "bad guy": if you get shot with this pellet, you are already worked up as part of engaging in an illegal act. (You might even be under the influence of drugs and/or alcohol, delaying the effects of getting shot). In such a case, this perpetrator is going to be very mad unless your air gun pellet takes him down. If he has buddies with him, they aren't going to be very happy, either.

In the laws eyes, how are you going to appear if you are carrying this airgun around? You are going to incur a legal risk by doing so, and even if you shoot someone in your home, how differently is the law going to look at you because you are shooting with a gun, even if it is an airgun?

Frankly, my choice would be a non-ballistic one. An airgun is too unreliable as a stopper and its use carries too much burden legally to make it practical, in my view.

It is the goal of licensing and regulation to control who gets to own and use the sort of deadly potential that a handgun (or any firearm) represents. Consider that as one looks to find a way around these regulations and carry an effective weapon without needing a license, that the governmental authorities have first of all tried to anticipate any way around their regulations, and second of all, they've had many years of experience to refine their regulations. In other words, if something requires no licensing at all, it is not likely to be a practical self defense device (like Monty Python's 16 ton weight).

RottLord wrote:Timmy, since u have an exposure more to the co2 pistols than most of us here, I'm bringing it under your notice. I recently came across the pellets called the Gamo Rocket (http://www.pyramydair.com/s/p/Gamo_Rock ... _150ct/423) and the Gamo PBA Armor .177 Cal, 6.8 Grains, Domed (http://www.pyramydair.com/s/p/Gamo_PBA_ ... d_80ct/594) made from a specially designed ballistic alloy and with a steel ball as the tip. The pellets are claimed to travel at a speed that's 30% more than that of a regular pellet and also has a deeper penetration and expansion capability. Now, given that a Beretta co2 .177 shoots at 425 ft/sec normally with RWS wadcutter or similar other pellets, the Gamo Rocket / Armor mathematically, shall travel at (425 + 127.5) = 552.5 ft/sec. The original Beretta 92FS 9 mm has a muzzle velocity of 1200 feet or 365 meters/second, which is, a little more than double of what my calculation with the co2 version and the Rocket pellets. Besides, ours is a warm country (this summer, the temp at Kolkata was 41.2 degrees C), which, I believe shall also have some effect on the thrust produced by the co2.

Now, taking everything under consideration (including the lesser weight of the projectile), would a CO2 gun have enough power, at least, to incapacitate an attacker through blunt trauma from a distance of 10 or 15 ft?

-- Wed Jul 01, 2009 16:05 --

A small review I read a couple of minutes back; could someone let me know about how authentic is the info that has been presented?

Post no. 19 (http://www.reviewcentre.com/review10663.html)

shotman. on 7th Dec 2002

de-bunker - I have been shooting guns for 8 years, so i know what i am taking about. I shoot my 92fs at 20 yards against steel traps the wadcutters do EXPEND quite a bit i have got the proof. 400fps is powerful if you think about it. Pellets go into wood (GO IN ABOUT 5MM) at 20 yards and I have shot against heavy clothes (7 yards) and guess what!! They go right through and still hit the trap so if i was to shoot you in the chest at close range (7-10m) do you really think you just get a way with red mark? It will go into the body (not right though or anything) but it will. The government says that it only takes 200fps to penetate the body. So what you know more then firarm experts. (go to homeoffice.co.gov and look for the fcc report on firarms. Further more people have been shot in the head with these gas guns and have nearly died. So you see i have researched and done tests. (shot at heavy/clothing at 7 yards against wood / brick at 7 and 20 yards) glass at 4 and 7 yards I have shot at 50 yards I have got the target to prove it, and if you read the booklet it says that it is "capable of firing a pellet at over 400 yards' GET THE BOOKLET AND SEE FOR YOURSELF.

All this research and reasoning and it only seems to me that you are bent on convincing yourself with the notion that an air gun/pistol is a viable tool of self defence.If you spend a bit of those energies on researching firearms in self defence,it might be very worth the effort.Sorry, I am not trying to be preachy or dismissive. But you need to understand that in the context of not getting a license does not mean that you turn to air guns for self defence.Also, in India, if the air gun fails the deal wood test, you need a firearm license to own it .

Best-
Vikram

Vikram, it's just that if I'm participating in a debate, I want to go the whole hog; if I'm to let someone know that a co2 is not an appropriate choice for SD, I must also present the facts. But I'm a newbie compared to you all, so I think its better to seek info in detail to upgrade myself as well.

-- Thu Jul 02, 2009 11:28 --

Timmy, thanks for the info; it was much needed.

-- Thu Jul 02, 2009 11:31 --

BTW, there had been an instance in my city a couple of months back when someone shot a thief invading his home with a .22 IHP; the police took the burglar away and no case was filed against the owner of the house who shot the thief.

-- Thu Jul 02, 2009 11:34 --

Also Vikram, if I'm importing a Beretta .177 co2, I won't be importing the powerlets; does that mean the airpistol shall stay with the customs till I procure one powerlet from the local market and take it to them for the test?

There is a difference between thief and determined attacker. Just imagine you want to stop a suicide bomber with air-gun. Practically speaking a high power cross bow has better stopping power than air-gun.