COLT PISTOL USED BY SHRI CHANDRA SHEKHAR AZAD

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Re: COLT PISTOL USED BY SHRI CHANDRA SHEKHAR AZAD

Postby bishnoi29 » Thu Feb 23, 2012 6:24 am

Hi Pran

If possible get some pic's of the pistol also.
We have to pay tribute to our freedom fighter's.
PEACE UP GUYS !!!!!
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Re: COLT PISTOL USED BY SHRI CHANDRA SHEKHAR AZAD

Postby essdee1972 » Thu Feb 23, 2012 11:50 am

Hammerhead, most of the arms were obtained from police stations / vehicles, money was obtained from donations, looting British sympathisers, and govt pay trucks. There were some attempts by revolutionaries to get arms from abroad. Ref. the activities of Har Dayal in US during WW1, Rash Behari Bose in Japan / SE Asia in the same period upto WW2, etc. Most of the attempts failed due to the superb (to give them their due) intelligence run by the Indian Political Service. For reference to Indian Political Service training and (only slightly exaggerated) activities, refer "Kim", by Kipling.

Timmy, there's a book called "On Secret Service, East of Constantinople", which gives the details of "Drang nacht Osten" (Drive to the East) - German / Turkish penetration attempts into India via Persia and Afghanistan, in an attempt to rouse Indian Nationalists to overthrow the Raj. This book is written from a British perspective (although quite fairly, with no attempts to belittle Germans / Turks (except the Pashas!) / Indians), . The story is basically the truth behind the novel "Greenmantle" by John Buchan (who also wrote "The Thirty-Nine Steps", made into a successful film by Hitchcock). Pretty thrilling!
Cheers!

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In a polity, each citizen is to possess his own arms, which are not supplied or owned by the state.Aristotle

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Re: COLT PISTOL USED BY SHRI CHANDRA SHEKHAR AZAD

Postby icemanV » Thu Feb 23, 2012 4:29 pm

I am now even more proud to be having one in my family's posession.

Nice nice 3 cheers.
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Re: COLT PISTOL USED BY SHRI CHANDRA SHEKHAR AZAD

Postby Hammerhead » Fri Feb 24, 2012 12:11 am

Hammerhead, most of the arms were obtained from police stations / vehicles, money was obtained from donations, looting British sympathisers, and govt pay trucks. There were some attempts by revolutionaries to get arms from abroad. Ref. the activities of Har Dayal in US during WW1, Rash Behari Bose in Japan / SE Asia in the


Thanks , my family lived through all that and we lost half of our property to RAJ and both my grand fathers ( mom's and dad's ) spend years and years in many jails over the time . And all my family uncles fought in 62,65,71 and so on ,that's where you learn first gun ownership and " Take a stand now , or there will be no grounds to stand " thing

I know all but my point is still same that the police in that time and now "Do not carry .32ACP". How and why they choose to carry this minion gun when they could have bigger calibers and fight to live other day - Haji
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing. - Edmund Burke
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Re: COLT PISTOL USED BY SHRI CHANDRA SHEKHAR AZAD

Postby essdee1972 » Fri Feb 24, 2012 11:04 am

Hammerhead, 0.32 might (just might.... my theory!) have been taken from a British sympathiser civilian. One, it's NPB, hence as you say, probably a civilian arm; and two, mostly pro-Raj people had guns back then. Also, probably some of the smuggled arms did get through in spite of efforts by the security men (who were mostly trying to stop the bigger consignments). One way to find out is to get the serial number and try Colt archives for info on that. Doubt that anyone in the govt would be interested! (seeing their attitude towards the gun wielding freedom fighters since '47)

My Uncle and grand Uncle who were with Surya Sen in Chittagong in those days did mention that they used "small" pistols for ease of concealment, as most of them wore dhotis and could stick the gun in the waist, without having the dhoti unravel (one guy was actually caught when his gun slipped out from his dhoti - ref "Do and Die" by Manini Sen). If they mentioned the bore ever, I seem to have forgotten.

On the other hand, I have read elsewhere (don't remember the source) that Azad had a Mauser - the bolt action WW1 German officer issue type. That of course, would require a full size holster and sling due to the sheer size.

Well, whatever gun Azad, Bhagat Singh, and all those guys used, the fact remains that they were heroes, who have not been given their due by the Govt. The title of the movie on Subhas Chandra Bose - "Bose, the Forgotten Hero" (Timmy, another one for you) - is very apt, and can be applied to all the gun-wielding heroes of our struggle for freedom!
Cheers!

EssDee
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In a polity, each citizen is to possess his own arms, which are not supplied or owned by the state.Aristotle

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Re: COLT PISTOL USED BY SHRI CHANDRA SHEKHAR AZAD

Postby ngrewal » Sat May 05, 2012 6:49 pm

Revolutionaries didnt have much money and procuring weapons and ammo required connections since none was being smuggled in.
Also these folks were really very very young without any training but they compensated greatly by their will and drive and desire. Their Life spam was hardly more than 5 years before being caught or they had to escape /exile.

All of the soldiers returning from war were rarely allowed to carry back their war trophies. There was only one effort part of Hindu-German Conspiracy wherein Germans ( San Francisco Attache Fran Von Papen later Chancellor of Germany) via Gahdars in US coordinated shipping of consignment of arms to Bagha Jatin et al in Orissa. British had already infiltrated the Ghadar movement and most of these revolutionaries were caught - Kartar Singh Sarabha, Pingle et al.

We do have a member here whose great grand uncle was part of this movement.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hindu%E2%8 ... Conspiracy

"In the United States, an elaborate plan and arrangement was made to ship arms from the country and from the Far East through Shanghai, Batavia, Bangkok and Burma.[49] Even while Herambalal Gupta was on his mission in China and Japan, other plans were explored to ship arms from the United States and East Asia. The German high command decided early on that assistance to the Indian groups would be pointless unless given on a substantial scale.[55] In October 1914, German Vice Consul E.H von Schack in San Francisco approved the arrangements for funds and armaments. $200,000 worth of small arms and ammunition were acquired by the German military attaché Captain Franz von Papen through Krupp agents, and arranged for its shipment to India through San Diego, Java, and Burma. The arsenal included 8,080 Springfield rifles of Spanish-American War vintage, 2,400 Springfield carbines, 410 Hotchkiss repeating rifles, 4,000,000 cartridges, 500 Colt revolvers with 100,000 cartridges, and 250 Mauser pistols along with ammunition.[55] The schooner Annie Larsen and the sailing ship SS Henry S were hired to ship the arms out of the United States and transfer it to the SS Maverick. The ownership of ships were hidden under a massive smokescreen involving fake companies and oil business in south-east Asia. For the arms shipment itself, a successful cover was set up to lead British agents to believe that the arms were for the warring factions of the Mexican Civil War.[2][47][56][57][58][59][60] This ruse was successful enough that the rival Villa faction offered $15,000 to divert the shipment to a Villa-controlled port.[2]
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Re: COLT PISTOL USED BY SHRI CHANDRA SHEKHAR AZAD

Postby TwoRivers » Sat May 05, 2012 10:58 pm

essdee1972 wrote:

On the other hand, I have read elsewhere (don't remember the source) that Azad had a Mauser - the bolt action WW1 German officer issue type. That of course, would require a full size holster and sling due to the sheer size.

!


Now that would be a strange gun; a pistol with a bolt and requiring both holster and sling. Mauser pocket pistols in .32 ACP were carried by many German officers. The only "issue" Mauser pistol in German service in WW1 was the Mauser "broomhandle" in caliber 9mm Parabellum. A cartridge surely not common in India at that time.
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Re: COLT PISTOL USED BY SHRI CHANDRA SHEKHAR AZAD

Postby TwoRivers » Sat May 05, 2012 11:10 pm

ngrewal wrote:"
The arsenal included 8,080 Springfield rifles of Spanish-American War vintage, 2,400 Springfield carbines, 410 Hotchkiss repeating rifles, 4,000,000 cartridges, 500 Colt revolvers with 100,000 cartridges, and 250 Mauser pistols along with ammunition.[55] The schooner Annie Larsen and the sailing ship SS Henry S were hired to ship the arms out of the United States and transfer it to the SS Maverick. The ownership of ships were hidden under a massive smokescreen involving fake companies and oil business in south-east Asia. For the arms shipment itself, a successful cover was set up to lead British agents to believe that the arms were for the warring factions of the Mexican Civil War.[2][47][56][57][58][59][60] This ruse was successful enough that the rival Villa faction offered $15,000 to divert the shipment to a Villa-controlled port.[2]


At best, these "Springfield" 'rifles would have been Krag-Jorgensen rifles and carbines in caliber .30-40, just as likely trapdoor single-shots in .45-70. There never was a "Springfield" .30-06 carbine.
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Re: COLT PISTOL USED BY SHRI CHANDRA SHEKHAR AZAD

Postby lazybones » Sat May 05, 2012 11:57 pm

Mauser pistols were floating around Calcutta around 1915. Broomhandle or pocket pistol I cannot say. In the famous Rodda Arms Case 50 Mauser pistols and 50,000 rounds of ammo were looted from the Calcutta gunshop of Rodda and Company http://www.indiankanoon.org/doc/568638/

By the time I was a gun crazy tyke in shorts, Rodda and Co had become a dealer in "Sanitary fittings". The first floor had a discreet gunsmithing section for old customers All that remained of the old legacy was a mini cannon in brass that was used as a door stopper. It's probably still there today.

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